Thirteen year-olds are horrifying humanoid creatures.
It was less than a decade ago that I was thirteen years old. It occurs to me now that either everything has changed since I was that age, or I have intentionally removed from my memory my entire adolescence. Maybe I should qualify the lead up there... I should have said: Thirteen year-old girls are horrifying humanoid creatures. Maybe they've always been horrifying--this is certainly possible. But technology isn't helping. The wrenching 'tween drama and anarchic "grammar" of my sister's AIM away messages alone is enough to curdle my stomach acid. And the music the kids are listening to these days! And no thirteen year-old should ever use the phrase "hook-up" in reference to peers of the opposite gender-bias. If I ever have female offspring, she will go to boarding school in the Yukon at age three, where there will be no MTV or internet or anything but snow. This is for her own good. She will know I love her because I will send her giant winter parkas and thick winter blankets on her birthdays because it is cold in the Yukon. I only know that it is cold in the Yukon because of the Calvin and Hobbes comic in which Calvin and Hobbes head for the Yukon, and ultimately fail because Calvin is six years-old and Hobbes is a stuffed tiger, and because the Yukon is remote from all of society, but good for sledding, For Christmas she will be allowed to return home, but in a bubble. Yukon, Ho!
That's pretty much it for tonight. I'm mulling over a lengthy conversation I had with the Unk Gil, and wondering how close something we were talking about was discussed in more literal (though ultimately unacheivable) terms by Habermas.
And how 'bout them Braves? Little 13th inning magic from Chipper Jones goes a long way. They've now scored a remarkably pitiful 2 runs in 22 innings, but are 1-1 on the season. I can live with that.
posted by Bob Howard @ 4:56 AM
17 comments
17 Comments:
As the mother of a soon-to-be-horrifying-thirteen-year-old-female-humanoid, and having one who has passed graciously into womanhood, I will have much to say when I get home, Bob :o)
Actually, your blog is headed, "Thirteen year-olds..." 13 year-olds are a much more horrifying endeavour than thirteen-year-olds. :O) IMHO.
Harry Robert,
I must admit I took almost devilish delight in the idea of your being the fretful father of a 13 year old girl.
Not that I don't think you'll be an awesome daddy, but it did occur to me that, even if only from a pragmatic stance, you'll wish there was an Omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent God who could help you to raise the horrifying female humanoid that sprang from your loins.
In fact, I don't doubt for one moment that "God help me" will be your mantra for several years while she (I'll call her Lucy--begins with an L) wraps herself in her Junior High cocoon that has to look exactly like everyone else's, and "Daddy I hate you, get out of my life, but first can you drive me and Suzy to the movies?"
I think you'll find to your consternation that your "moral values are only valid in so far as they affect me personally"--or whatever that is that you spout every so often on Wednesday afternoons--won't fly when Lucy asks you why she shouldn't have sex with the whole Yukon baseball team as long as she's on the pill and wearing the giant parka you sent last Christmas. :o)
And I'd like to be a fly on the wall when her, "But Daddy, Bubba's been out of prison for 2 years now, and in another 20 years it really won't matter that he's 18 years older than I am, and his kids-the one's he's allowed to see-really like me, and he gives 10% of his drug money to the Catholic Church" hits you in your Braves-loving butt.
Or, at the very least, methinks you'll wish she believed in an all-loving, omnibenevolent God who adores her and wants only the very best for her, including a pure walk down the aisle, a husband that will cherish her and keep her only unto him as long as they both shall live and a daddy who calls her "Princess" and is to be honoured among men.
*sigh* I must say I'm enjoying this, Bob.
Anyways, enough for now. Just a few words from a Mum who watched a girl, who should have been championed by her daddy, go from dolls and ballet to drugs and boys and booze, to a near death drug overdose on Mothers' Day to lovin'-the-Lord-long-term Missionary work in Brazil. :o) Can I say, "Praise the Lord!" on your Blog, Bob?
Yes, Bob. You'll definitely want to appeal to a higher Moral Law and to a God who sees the end from the beginning and wants more for Lucy than even you do. (Jeremiah 29:11)
Love you, Bob <>< See you Wednesday.
Who is diurnal fundie - I think I'm in love... I laughed out loud at your post, Bobby, and at dirunal fundie's retort (even louder I must say).
The fair maiden who is being discussed here is none other than "Bob's" little sister, Katherine, and my daughter. She actually happens to be the tamest in her crowd, when she actually has a crowd, and infinitely easier to raise than 13 year-old boys, of which I have thus far endeavored to raise two.
I do agree that you'll make a wonderful daddy, you are a wonderful son and brother. Should I embarrass you and post the poem this thirteen year-old wrote about you?
love,
mom
May I call you "Bobby"?
You are only allowed to call him Bobby if you were in a position to name him before he could name himself for you! so parents, blood aunts and uncles enjoy this prerogative, in the same way that Bobby's mother, and grandmother, and my cousin Richard (his wife and friends call him Rich, by his designation), call me "Gilbert" without generating consternation--but if my wife or friends called me Gilbert I would cringe, as I named myself to them othewise. As for you, I will call you "diurnal fundie" in respect for your own self denomination (irony intented), and thoroughly enjoy reading your posts as such!! :-)
OK... "Dirty Rotten Pizza Delivery Boy Filthy Heathen Sinner" it is then!! (HIS own self-denomination, I hasten to add!!) I do call him "Bob" for short, though. :o)
Have an awesome Sunday!! <><
As light-hearted in spirit as your post may have been, my favorite fundie, I really hate to be misquoted and have my philosophy marginalized in the process... especially for the benefit of flat out wrong fundamentalist christian assertions about "truth."
I have never said anything like "moral values are only valid valid in so far as they affect me personally." I believe that the quote you're looking for is something more along the lines of the following: "Each individual's freedom extends only so far as the next individual's freedom." If I have a fundamentalist bone in my body, it is that belief--that the only foundational rule of the universe is that no one ought to infringe on anyone else's freedom.
Secondly, and perhaps this wasn't clear, the whole point of the Yukon boarding school is that it is female only. Now, maybe she'll have to fend off the softball team, but that's another story for a less family-friendly blog, if you know what I mean.
But more seriously on that note... Believe it or not, my dear fundie, there exists a morality beyond the fundamental christian outlook on life, beyond traditional catholic dogma, and indeed beyond the fear-based, guilt-ridden, self-loathing, humanity-hating measures of control excercised upon we humans for millenia. It is indeed possible to explain to a 13-year-old why she shouldn't be gangbanging the baseball team without telling her that it's not what the Almighty had in mind when he invented genitalia--and in much more convincing fashion, I might add.
Finally, you can't possibly imagine the faith I have in the potential of myself and every other human being out there, and I can't begin to imagine how that faith will be exponentially expanded when I do have children. The "omnibenevolent god" you're talking about, that is a god characterized by always doing good, would hardly allow for a soul, specifically the soul of my daughter, to suffer for eternity in hell simply because she didn't accept the fact of her own human worthlessness. Come to think of it, if I raise a daughter who becomes a 'born-again' type, it is then that I will truly be horrified, because I will have failed to impart upon my own flesh and blood one of the few truths I have discovered in my own short lifetime--that by the simple fact of the existence of her own consciousness she is already worth infinitely more than any fundamentalist would ever allow her to believe.
I've said it before and I'll say it again... the reason I could never believe in the god of your fundamentalism is because if I believed in him I would not want to spend eternity with him.
On what grounds could you (Bob) possibly tell your daughter that she is wrong to engage in group sex? It couldn't be because she's somehow violating the freedom of the guys...they've assented to the act. And she's not violating her own freedom, because she willingly spread her legs. Everybody involved is perfectly in line, freedom maintained exquisitely.
Without recourse to the wacky, outdated Christian ethics, you must admit that as long as everyone is acting freely, no act could be considered objectively wrong under your Sartrian philosophy. You haven't given yourself a means to do so.
Time for philosophy class.
The fundamental law of freedom I mentioned is the only "law" I see that extends to all people equally. Beyond that, I don't think that I can make any moral claim that extends to cover the way everyone should act in any given situation. This, of course, is the appeal of catholicism, and most major world religions--they provide a nice tidy system of rules and regulations to be followed in order to gain salvation.
The Christian ethics are all well and good, for the most part. Jesus said some really great stuff--in fact, I don't really have a quarrel with anything Jesus actually said. He spoke in parables "so that they will not understand." It's the interpretaion and implementation of his thoughts into various religions that is the problem.
If you believe that there are no ethics beyond christianity, as both Louise and Brian have suggested, I don't know how to respond to you. Jews, muslims, atheists, and all the rest could then only accidentally commit good acts. And an "accidentally good" act is not good at all--generally speaking when people define "good" they put an intention behind it.
There are plenty of purely practical reasons why my 13-year-old daughter should not engage in promiscuous sexual activity with an entire baseball team at once. Disease and psychological trauma are the first that come to mind. If I raise a daughter who is prone to making such decisions as listed above, then I have already failed. What I won't do, however, is set her up for failure by giving her a religion, or a 'relationship' if Louise prefers, that tells her she is a doomed sinner.
I'm not saying that morality doesn't exist beyond the fundamental law quoted above, I'm saying that it exists beyond the single-minded notion that only christianity has it.
I suppose I should apologise for misquoting you, firstly, but to be honest, it didn't change anything.
I am not a philosopher, either, but I do know a straw man when I see one...or should I say straw "god"?
I don't think I'd like to spend eternity with the god of your warped perception of so-called christianity either.
I'm not going to spend hours dissecting what you wrote; but I will defend the God of the Bible, and let Him speak for Himself:
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
But God demonstrates His own love for us in this: While we were yet sinners, the Christ died for us.
You say that I say that there are no ethics beyond Christianity. Read again, Bob. I never said that.
Mormons have very high standards of morality--much higher than mine, I might add--as do Orthodox Jews, Muslims etc. My atheist father-in-law is the most selfless person I know. But Jesus didn't come to give us a moral standard, Bob. He IS the Moral Standard. And He didn't come to suck the life out of sinners, He came that "they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly."
John 12:46-48 I have come into the world as a light, so that no one who believes in Me should stay in darkness. As for the person who hears My words but does not keep them, I do not judge him. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it. There is a judge for the one who rejects Me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day."
Didn't understand "fear-based, guilt-ridden, self-loathing, humanity-hating...measure of control"...?
That's not my God. Is this one of yours?
Perfect love casts out fear. (1 Jn 4:18)
I've been justified--declared "not guilty" (Romans 5:1)
I am "fearfully and wonderfully made" (Psalm 139:14)
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in the Christ, Jesus. (Romans 8:1)
The God of the Bible never calls me worthless; He calls me a pearl, a treasure, a precious lamb, and when I was lost in the world, he came for me.
He is, however, a God of wrath. He is just. The God of the Old Covenant is the God of the New.
Isaiah prophesied:
"But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all." (Is. 53:5-6)
All have sinned.
All have gone astray.
All turned his own way.
BUT. God has a big "but".
The righteous, holy, just, wrathful God of the Old and New Covenants gave us a Way out.
He didn't leave us in the sinful state. He sent His Son, Jesus, to take the wrath upon Himself on the Cross, so that by faith (not works) I could enter in to His New Covenant, be covered by His sacrificial, subsitutionary atoning blood, and be filled with His Holy Spirit Who will enable me to walk in His holiness (Ezekiel 36:26). Not freedom to sin, but freedom from sin's power over me.
I'm not a finished work, yet. I'll know I'm perfect when Jesus comes back wearing a WWLD (What Would Louise Do) bracelet.
I think I'm done writing, Bob. work calls.
I love you very much. I think you know it. :o)
See you Wednesday.
PS I get to spend eternity with John Smoltz!! Woo hoo!!!
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/braves/0504/30church.html?UrAuth=`N]NUObNUUbTTUWUXUTUZTZU]UWU_U\UZUaUbUcTYWYWZV
Hope this link works.
Hate to beat a dead horse, but here goes anyway.
Assume there is no chance your daughter could get a disease, pregnancy, etc. Why would she be psychologically traumatized if she assented to the act? Why would you have "failed" as a parent if she went through with it? Her freedom has been perfectly maintained. The only way her psyche could be affected is if she has some innate sense of proper sexual shame (see Karol Wojtyla's "Love and Responsibility) that tells her she should respect herself as a creation of God.
And obeying a "nice tidy system of rules and regulations" simply in order to go to Heaven is not what true Christians do. That's actually much closer to what Muslims do, since the relationship between Allah and man is that of a master to his slave, not a Father to his children; Allah demands rote obedience. True Christians, on the other hand, perform services in the spirit of divine love, not necessarily always needing to think of the reward.
I hate school.
I was referring to catholicism in particular when I mentioned rules and regulations, not pure christianity. I believe the rest of the problems raised can be answered with a more careful reading of my other responses.
Enough!
Enough!!!
My goodness!! Whoever Diurnal Fundie is, she is one very intelligent, quick-witted person!!
I think Colour Me Fuchsia should just give in and do whatever she tells him to for the rest of his life. Anyone with that much insight into the minds of thirteen-year-old girls, who still has a sense of humour, must be right about everything!! I mean, religion, politics, fashion, career choices, feminism, piercings...everything! Just listen to her, man. She won't put you wrong. She's a true Guru. A modern-day Prophet to be sure. She should be the next pope...or popette, I suppose. (Popitta? Popess? Popesicle?)
Oh boy, Oh boy, Colour Me, you are one very lucky little bugger to have such divine wisdom on your team.
And I agree with your Mum...I think I'm in love, too!
Well, Mr Fuchsia, my boy, you might as well just get baptised tomorrow and get it over with. Mark my words. You're done for.
(o:
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krauss: Unless I am mistaken, I have a gut feeling that your grossly misrepresentative characterizations regarding "what Muslims do" can be sourced from racist religion professors at fundamentalist catholic institutions, and not your own astute researches and self-responsible inquiry into the subject matter, of which I am certain you, as a remarkably intelligent person, are capable. Oh, and by the way, Jesus charged us all to be "doulos," or slaves, to one another, as an expression of our love, and a reiteration of his own identity as "doulos." I am certain you can consider the possibility that sincere Muslim lovers divine truth, like sincere Christian lovers of divine truth, might be capable of more nuanced readings of their scripture then the prepackaged cookie-cutter salvation formulas which their mutual fundamentalisms provide? The only reason I bother going on here is because I can't bear to think of you as duped into the kind of suffocating mentality about another religion whereby the populace in general has been sucked into the kind of wicked generalizations and mindless reductions that make war, an irreducible wrong, a possibility for a christian, an irony so irresolvable that any one who holds it should take a good look in the mirror and try to remember what "love your enemy" and "who is my neighbor" really means.
Sometimes Bob, I think you forget how we were at 13. Katherine is not nearly as bad as other 13 year old's I know. The grammar sucks, but as long as she doesn't write papers with "any" as "ne" then who cares. Katherine is wonderful, and I love her like she's my own sister, as well as your whole family. At least she's not acting the way Sam Faustini was when she was 13, which resulted in pregnancy at 16. Think about it. <3
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